Okay. Do we have any questions here?

Right.

Male voice: This is known that — but, you know, most psychics and mediums and such like that, I mean most of them are pretty nuts. But I was just kicking — mingling around in some of the other countries, and I have seen some phenomena which leads me to think that there may be — put it — disembodied thetans who can sort of, from time to time, pick up somebody else's body. What do you think on this?

I think they're thetans.

Male voice: I know they're thetans.

But I think there are thetans around that don't have bodies.

Male voice: But who can pick one up for a short while and do what they want to do and then drop it again?

No. All those I ran into couldn't have one. They couldn't control one anymore.

Male voice: Ah . . .

They could influence one.

Male voice: Oh, that's what it is.

Have you ever seen a deer know you were there?

Male voice: Yeah.

You find in the lower rungs of life this sixth sense — a communication line which actually exists through mest and energy and warns a person, one way or the other. And many times this can easily be confused with a pure telepathic. But it has a communication line. The awareness which receives it, however, is so alert — so hysterically alert — as to not connote a calm look. And remember, he doesn't know — he merely supposes. So that you get this harmonic activity going on.

Now, one of the things that is baffling in looking at these states — something I had to get used to: The only thing wrong with a thetan is some aspect of being a thetan. There isn't anything else. And you can take any aspect of being a thetan and magnify it out of proportion to other aspects on a downscale basis, and you can get something that's a pretty credible thing but which is way out of gear. It's an oddity that the only thing wrong with a thetan is being a thetan. Not that there's anything wrong with being a thetan, you understand? Get the remark in its true framework here. But if you look over aberration, you'll find out that those things which are most basically and natively a thetan or closest to being a thetan, are the aberrations, which is quite remarkable. For instance, you take somebody with an invisible field. These invisible fields can be real tough on an auditor, see? They're — can be a little bit rough to get rid of. He can get rid of them now. He's got the techniques to do so. But before, they were totally resistant. Well, what's a thetan but an invisible thing?

If you want to — here's a handy rule to look over the scale of what's most likely wrong with somebody, is just find that thing which is most thetanesque — you see, there is something wrong with him, but that thing which is most thetanesque will be the wrongest. It's out of gear. Well, this gives people the idea that there's something wrong with being a thetan. So, they'll — really will try to trap thetans and bang them down Tone Scale, and do all kinds of silly things, you see? But the thing which persists is the thing which is out of gear. And actually what it is, is an effort to return to his own identity, and he picks the only thing he can pick up that he recognizes is his own identity and exaggerates it. And it gives you a very mad view. And they will exaggerate this to some fantastic degree.

We get a medium who is mad as a hatter, hypnotic as can be, but is holding on violently to total knowingness, see? Well, we don't have to ask the question, "How total is the knowingness or how accurate is it?" We merely see somebody who has become anxious about becoming mest and is therefore violently being a spirit. But what are they being? They're being the only aspect of a spirit which they can still attain. And they will exaggerate this — totally out of gear.

Now, this medium can't do things on her own determinism, let us say — doesn't recognize it as a thetan characteristic, see? This being cannot actually control her own or another's body — doesn't recognize that as a spiritual activity, don't you see? So they deny a whole bunch of thetan activities and exaggerate one, way out of gear, and we get all sorts of manifestations as we go down the line.

All a neurosis or psychosis is, is an exaggeration of an ability. The ability goes out of control and so forth. So therefore, we can look at any two thetans: one is being a medium and the other is being a thetan, see? — very, very totally. That's fine, see? One is sane and the other isn't. And we get all tangled up. We know it's possible, see? We know, ourselves, subjectively that it's possible to do these things. We have some reality on the fact that this person who is strictly fruitcake can do these things, you see? Funny part of it is the person can do these things but otherwise is crazy. Well, what's happening here? We just merely have an exaggeration of an ability without its accompanying abilities. And therefore, it looks very isolated and very crazy. You have to regain ability by regaining abilities.

You know, I think most of those people in the Orient were simply exaggerating one ability or another, don't you see? And anybody can exteriorize on an inversion. Life can become so untenable that you can no longer confront it.

Well, for instance, what chance has some Indian to be at cause over life who has to step over cockroaches as they scuttle across the walk? You've probably seen them do that.

Audience: Mm-hm.

What chance has he, see, if he must consider this sacred and that sacred and this untouchable and that untouchable and he must have nothing to do with mest of any kind and so forth? He's going up the spout, that's for sure.

Now, the odd part of it is it's quite a game in itself. And it has its recompense. We used to get people every once in a while — they go up the pole. They hit one of these things and exaggerate them like mad and be mad as hatters for a month or two. Maybe some of you have gone up the pole. I know I was up the pole once for about six months — glorious sensation — didn't get anyplace. It's not necessarily being mad; it's becoming much too certain and not knowing quite what you're certain about.

Now, the production of some of this phenomena lies in the field of Black Dianetics as well as clearing. You have to get somebody totally off balance or get him to manufacture, exclusively, elation particles or something. You have to unbalance him in order to ascend him this far out. Truth of the matter is, as much joy, verve and so forth, as that, is recoverable when a thetan recovers a great many of his abilities, you understand? But you could make him recover one of them selectively and have him be very, very happy about this thing.

Now, many of us has had little odds and ends of this sort of thing turn on, and we wonder how in the name of common sense we're doing this, or something happens. We slip on the banana peel of our own common sense, and off it goes — we turn it off. But the most common one is to find out that you are inventing all the problems you are involved with so that you can solve them. You find that out suddenly. It'll stay on variably. You may leave it on for only five minutes; you may leave it on for five or ten days. And then you'll decide that's all for the birds, that you're not going to get anyplace doing this, and suddenly it goes off. You realize somehow or another that you turned it off but you're not quite sure how you turned it off. Well, the funny part of it is, you're not quite sure how you turned it on either.

Well, you recover one of these abilities suddenly in an isolated sphere, and it throws everything you're doing totally out of balance. You're actually taking a preview of what it's like to be an OT. Only, if you were an OT, there wouldn't be any mystery about it, don't you see? And you wouldn't turn it back off again. Get the idea?

These exaggerated abilities — sudden exaggerated abilities — you can call them manics. The ability to feel well, the ability to feel powerful, the ability to be elated, the ability to be totally happy — these things can turn on with no counterbalancing factors of any kind and nothing else to accompany them. They sit there as a lone rock and they get battered by the seas of fate until you blow them up. And you say, "Well, I want nothing more to do with that." It's quite amusing.

You'll turn these things on in preclears — much more likely to with the processing of 1950 and '51 than with the processing of the last few years. And it's improbable that you will turn this phenomenon on very much with the processes you're using at this minute.

Beauties of Dianetics — the beauties of Dianetics consisted of, of course, turning on phenomena — all manner of phenomena. I've seen somebody go into a total "feel wonderful" — total, see, for about three days — just turn on suddenly in a session, you know? Person wouldn't go on being processed. They felt too wonderful for words.

I learned by about '53 not to pay too much attention to this, and not to let them get out of session because they'd fall flat on their faces and probably be sick as dogs in two or three days, you see? They'd had an experience, however, and to that experience they're liable to cling.

I had somebody one time in '53 — all of her life she had been "waiting for the light." And I ran her on something about spotting spots in space or something of that sort — some kind of a contact process. And the next thing you know, the light that she had been waiting for was moving right straight in on her and she got into the middle of it. And she said, "That is wonderful. That's just what I've been waiting for. How gorgeous this is. How beautiful this is."

And I kept right on processing her — what a violent thing to do. Now, actually I didn't push her up high enough for her to tolerate the fact that I had done her out of it. She's never forgiven me. It was a "beautiful experience." I was moving her right into the middle of an electronic implant with the processing, you know, and moving her right on through it. And I moved her right on through and out the other side. But she conceived that the only game she could have would be to wait to move into the middle of it. That was the only game she had. And I moved her into the middle of it. She was, therefore, perfectly satisfied.

But what would have happened to her in the next twenty-four hours? She would have been totally satisfied, and then whommm — bang. As a matter of fact, this particular case was taught to see while exteriorized and though blind — was a very valuable attribute, and yet she wanted nothing to do with that attribute at all. She was still playing this old game of waiting for the light.

Once in a while you'll have a preclear start to gibber about the fact, "Well, I — I know what we're doing now; the light is turning on." You know, you're hitting one of those old religious implants.

That's the time to say, "Oh no!"

Fortunately, you have a process that doesn't leave them parked. They keep going upscale. Don't think preclears won't occasionally try to quit on you, though, because they still do. They think they're attaining something or going in a direction they don't want to go in. They feel that they're maybe losing a game that they think is terribly valuable. And you have to slug them on through. Well, unlike this person in '53, you'll win up to a point of where they'll be satisfied with where you got them. If you left them at some interim point, why, this manic would simply fade out.

Here is an exaggerated ability — an ability to feel wonderful, something like that — an ability to feel all-knowing.

Female voice: I did that yesterday.

Yeah.

It's fascinating to take a look and find out a piece of what you could become. But it's only a piece of what you could become, and that's what's wrong with it. It's a little pie slice a millimeter wide, and you can have the whole pie, so why settle for a small slice?

Yes?

Male voice: On this mock-up process, is there any value to having the preclear do something with the mock-up after he's made it, or should you just neglect that?

That's a very good point. That's a very good point. You, today, neglect that.

Male voice: Okay.

Let them accumulate, because if they are accumulating, he is on an obsessive continue of mock-ups and he wants them, and his mechanisms are keeping them pulled in toward him, you see? So he's going on unconsciously making them after he has made them. He makes a mock-up and then something takes over and continues its automaticity. Well now, to ask him to do something with the mock-up is not bad, it's merely a waste of time. The thing will act, eventually, as a remedy of havingness. And it just squares. Got it?

Male voice: Thank you.

Okay.

Male voice: What prevents a Theta Clear from becoming an OT? It's not his banks.

What prevents him from becoming one? Oh, insecurity.

Male voice: Unfamiliarity?

Yeah. Unfamiliarity is a better phrasing of it.

Male voice: Right, sir. Thank you.

You could probably turn loose a Clear and he would eventually become an OT. I mean, it probably would happen. I watched somebody become — who is half-Clear, becoming Clear without processing. You know, they're just working on up the line. Every couple of days I see this person, this person tells me a couple of new cognitions. It's interesting — I mean, the trap is sprung. Remember, I used to tell you with what terrible difficulty a person must hold an aberration into place?

Audience: Yes. Mm-hm.

It's an arduous thing to do. They're fairly easy to tip over. And you start to spring the trap and it goes on opening.

Yes?

Male voice: What is the relationship of a black and white field to what we've been doing — that is, the field of black and white process?

Turning black fields white?

Male voice: And flows and so forth within their field.

All right. This merely puts the preclear at cause — whatever he can do with them. And when we used to turn black fields white, he found he could do something with them. And this was evidently his total encouragement. Now, as far as flows are concerned, he had been the subject of these flows, and he himself had never made them flow. And we had the automaticity being taken over by the preclear, and of course, made him feel better.

Male voice: Mm-hm.

A black field is a not-know and is a bad one because it does this: it prevents him from having. A black field is a resistance toward an inflow. Now, you start to process him on keeping things from going away and you're liable to excite these black fields because they're doing exactly the contrary thing. And as a result you get many phenomena occurring.

I don't know that I understood your question totally — is that. . .

Male voice: Well, that seemed to be a little bit different kind of a field than the field that we seem to be working with here, and I'm a little bit confused on the mechanics.

No, a field is, I'm afraid, just a field. They have all kinds of different aspects and manifestations . . .

Male voice: Just apparencies?

. . . they have tremendous differences of rationale behind them but they all surrender on the same laws.

Male voice: Okay.

You bet.

Male voice: You mentioned one time you wanted to find out if persons who not-knew an object — and can pass his hand through it.

Yeah.

Male voice: You remember in the student who not-knew other people's pictures . . .

Yeah.

Male voice:. . . and not-knew that consideration . . .

Right.

Male voice:. . . not-knew his own pictures, not-knew that consideration, was up at Tone 40 for a brief bit.

Right. Is that right?

Male voice: Yeah.

He was up at Tone 40 for a brief bit?

Male voice: Yeah. He could not-know the object and not-know that consideration.

Yeah. He would be. He would be.

Yes?

Male voice: Why in this process do you mock up the item with reference to the body?

Now, what's this, now?

Male voice: In the Creative Processes . . .

Right.

Male voice:. . . well, previously you had not mocked them up with "To the right of that body," "To the left of that body," as a particular part of a command.

Mm-hm.

Male voice: In this process where — we're running right now, I want to know why it is that it is now done that way.

Orientation.

Male voice: Orientation . . .

Body is his commonest reference point. And all the time you're doing it, this — and I told you, this process has a lot of tricks connected with it. There are a tremendous lot of sneak plays. Well, that keeps the body from going away, too.

Male voice: It sure does.

Mm.

Male voice: That's what — / just wondered if that was . . . Well, I had discovered that, and I thought that. . .

That is the reason.

Male voice:. . . was intended.

Yeah.

Male voice: All right.

As well as keeping the preclear oriented.

Male voice: Right.

Second male voice: You might say, it helps keep the body from going away.

Oh yeah. Yeah. I can see what you would mean, there.

Yes?

Male voice: What would you call a Clear who was getting processing?

That's not so bad — that's not so bad. And I was trying to figure out what you should call them, and I finally decided you would probably call them pre-OTs.

Audience: (various responses)

A pre-OT — yeah. Clear was a very finite state. It didn't imply doing anything. OT simply implies being Clear and doing something. So, you would have a state of pre-OT.

A Clear can be processed, by the way, which is quite remarkable. You can run an awful lot of Havingness on a Clear but what are you doing? You're actually jumping over from the definition of Clear which is the second universe of the mind being cleared up, and you're now clearing the fourth, the physical universe. And you'll clear that up, too. And the gradient scale of that probably has a lot of connectedness connected with it, and then mocking it up. Got it?

Male voice: Sure.

Female voice: I was kidding someone, telling him he'd be the first non-Clear to make an OT. Could a non-Clear make an OT?

I should not think so. We might have a case of somebody not being Clear but being about as Clear as pea soup, performing some function of an OT, you see, an exaggerated ability of some sort or another — a terrific liability to doing this. But I bet there are plenty of people here who have seen such a person — had actually one OT or two OT isolated abilities in a mass of pea soup.

Yeah?

Male voice: The principal thing on that as I see it is one of — one, of responsibility and two, of Straightwire between cause and effect.

Right. Right. Very definitely. Yes. He doesn't take any responsibility for his gift, by the way. That's why a medium always has to be operated by somebody else — on automatic.

Second male voice: Because that can be triggered in an entirely different area, too. I know someone who was doing this who was quite sane.

Oh yes.

Second male voice: But it wasn't that that was doing it. It was a different game. It was a game called husband-wife relationships that was causing it and the husband was psycho. And that was what was causing it, I bet. I just cognited on this.

Yeah. Yeah.

Male voice: So it's not always quite direct.

Right. No. No. I myself could do a swami act the like of which you never saw the like of. I used to be very much in demand around Washington, here, when I was going to school and when I was a writer around here, just on this basis — swami acts.

I sure had one FBI agent going crazy, though. I think I've told you that story.

Audience: No. Tell us.

Oh, a bunch of girls, government attorneys, they were all girls and attorneys, and they lived in an apartment. And they used to have me over to their parties every once in a while. And one night the party was going very dull, and I felt a somewhat fatherly interest in these girls so I busted out a deck of cards and started telling fortunes. And I told their fortunes to all comers and so forth. Of course, I was reading their pictures. I'd carefully restimulate their pictures and read them. I know that's what I was doing now. And this amazed them and so forth, and it was all going along wonderfully. I had a bath towel wrapped around my head.

And they had an FBI agent there. And this FBI agent took himself very seriously as a sleuth. So he came over and he got his fortune told, and I told him the number of the case he was working on before I got through. And he was very upset because it was a very secret case. And I told him all about it and told him where he'd find the man he was looking for and so forth, and did a bunch of swami stuff on it and appeared very mysterious and then called for the next one. And we were just going through the run this way.

And this guy, after I unwrapped the bath towel and had myself a drink of scotch, got me over in a corner and he said to me, "How did you know that?"

And he was being very upset by now, you see, and so on. He didn't have to put on an act. Other people weren't standing around looking at him, you know? And he was kind of shivering and he was asking me very searchingly about this. So I quieted him down. I pulled the deck of cards I'd been using out of my pocket, turned the backs of them over and showed him that they were readers, which is to say that they were a marked deck. And he looked at this and he said, "Oh!" with a great sigh of relief.

Well, that was the end of that party and that's the end of this question period.

Thank you very much.